Live Chat

Time for more tech talk so let us begin. Many people have been asking me a question on the nature of matter and energy and almost all of them have no idea what they are talking about. Now, granted... i am not a scientist and my knowlegde of this field is limited but i shall try to clarify a few things as best i can.

First off... the distiction of matter and energy and the view that they are seperate entities is false. People talk about matter and energy as if there were a difference between the two... there is no difference. Matter is energy, energy makes up matter. They are one in the same. But you ask... how can they be the same when they both behave differently and one is tangible and one is intangible? This is where a popular theory currently being studied comes into play. I beleive the theory is called Quantum Resonance and it serves to explain why identical forces can manifest so differently from one another.

Everything in the universe is made up of energy, this has been proven. Energy can exist in many forms and matter is one of the forms energy can take but even so the matter is still energy... just in a different composition. How then can matter be solid or have substance when energy does not? This is where the theory comes in.

It is posited that energy and matter, (one in the same mind you), are made up out of strands or strings which constantly vibrate and resonate. The theory goes that what determines whether energy becomes matter with substance or remains as pure intangible energy is determined by how intense the resonance of the strings is and how powerful their vibrations are. Energy with high resonace is what we call matter; the higher the resonance the more solidity and substance the energy will have. Low resonance energy is what we think of when we hear the word (Energy). The lower the resonance the more intangible and less substance the energy will have.

It is the resonance of the strings that determines whether energy takes the form of matter or remains as it is. Higher res = matter, lower res = pure energy. I will post some more about this topic later.

_________________
Our father whoart in Hell unhallowed be thy name. Thy dominion come, thy will be done on Earth as it is in Hell. Grant us this day our daily pleasure and bring suffering to our enemies... and lead us not into slavery but deliver us unto freedom. For thine is the power and the glory and the majesty forever and ever. Hail Satan

Now i shall give you an example. Take a simple fan blade and see it in your mind. A typical fan blade consists of 3 to 4 prongs attached to a central hub which controls their movement. When the fan is off there are atleast 3 open spaces between the blades which you can easily pass material through with no difficulty. Now turn on the fan. Notice that now it becomes difficult to pass material through. This is because when the fan is moving the spaces get smaller due to the blades moving faster. The faster the blades move the harder it becomes to pass material through them. Also notice that when moving the fan blades stop looking like seperate objects and begin to look like one increasingly solid shape. The blades are moving so fast that you cannot percieve the blades and you cannot pass material through it.

Now imagine that you accelerate the fan blades to the speed of light; (impossible i know but bear with me). If you could do this the fan blades would be moving so fast that you could not pass any material through them. It would not lop off your finger of like it would at lower speeds, your finger would not even be able to pass through enough for that effect. At that speed the fanblades are moving so fast that they essentially are now one solid object. They are moving so fast that for all intensive purposes there ARE no spaces between the blades for you to stick your finger in. You would also not see the movement of the fan blades either. They would be moving so fast that they would be imperceptable to our sight. For all intensive purposes the fan blades are now one solid object through which matter can not pass what so ever.

This is the concept behind the theory of Quantum Resonance. When energy attains very high resonance it becomes more substantial and tangible. Energy that attains this level of resonance becomes what we call matter. It is still energy but because it resonates far higher then the other energy around it it gains substance and from our point of view becomes tangible. The lower the resonance of the energy trying to interact with the matter the less able it is to affect it. Only energy resonating at our near the matter's level will be able to pass through; to all lower res energy the matter is solid and impenetrable.

As a final example, imagion punching a hole in your wall. When you do so your hand does not pass through like a ghosts; it meets much resistance and the force of the impact can be enough to damage your hand if you are not careful. You assume that your hand cannot go through the wall because it is hard and solid. No no no... the wall is neither hard nor solid, it merely resonates at a much higher level then your hand. It may feel hard and solid but it is not. Your hand resonates far less then the wall and thus you cannot pass your hand through it without expending much energy and likely damaging the wall itself.

The wall is matter but it is not different from energy, it is energy but becuase of its resonance it takes the form of what we call matter.

Anyone have comments?

_________________
Our father whoart in Hell unhallowed be thy name. Thy dominion come, thy will be done on Earth as it is in Hell. Grant us this day our daily pleasure and bring suffering to our enemies... and lead us not into slavery but deliver us unto freedom. For thine is the power and the glory and the majesty forever and ever. Hail Satan

I can't tell you how many times people who argue that they have a soul (or that the human soul exists) use the argument that energy cannot be destroyed, it is merely transferred.

The human body - comprised of matter - is energy, as explained here. There is no evidence for any energy beyond that, so when your body perishes it changes form - essentially you are immortal because the atoms that make up your body will never be destroyed. But your conciseness.... now that is another story. Since your conciseness resides within your brain which is part of your body, it should dissappears once you body converts to other forms.

_________________
ceytin
-------
"Learn to accept, even welcome pain - for if you do not fear pain... if the thought of physical, emotional or spiritual anguish cannot dissuade you from the true path - then no enemy, however strong, can defeat you...no struggle, however long, can deter you...nor circumstance, however wrong, can keep you from your destiny."

Um... i was not talking about the afterlife on this thread. I was trying to explain the concept of matter. I think you posted on the wrong thread.

_________________
Our father whoart in Hell unhallowed be thy name. Thy dominion come, thy will be done on Earth as it is in Hell. Grant us this day our daily pleasure and bring suffering to our enemies... and lead us not into slavery but deliver us unto freedom. For thine is the power and the glory and the majesty forever and ever. Hail Satan

ummm... I know. I just thought this related to the afterlife hence my comment - and since you are a proponent of the afterlife and therefore a soul i wondered if you had considered your own post in light of that subject.

_________________
ceytin
-------
"Learn to accept, even welcome pain - for if you do not fear pain... if the thought of physical, emotional or spiritual anguish cannot dissuade you from the true path - then no enemy, however strong, can defeat you...no struggle, however long, can deter you...nor circumstance, however wrong, can keep you from your destiny."

True... it could be applicable.

_________________
Our father whoart in Hell unhallowed be thy name. Thy dominion come, thy will be done on Earth as it is in Hell. Grant us this day our daily pleasure and bring suffering to our enemies... and lead us not into slavery but deliver us unto freedom. For thine is the power and the glory and the majesty forever and ever. Hail Satan

Well, my graduation in on the area (I'm a Physician), and I can tell you all that the concept energy=matter is right, having in mind the old Einstein energy relationship:
E = m.c^2
Where m is the mass of the body, and c is the speed of light, the higher velocity in universe.
But at the very same time, we must have in mind the Thermodynamics, with the principles like Entropy and volume of the body, and the conditions.
At the very start of the universe (the Big-Bang), all was in energy form, for the volume was very small, and when it starts to grow, the energy was distibuted, as the entropy become more and more smaller. We can say that the higher volume, the lesser energy per unit of volume will be find.
Let's supose that in the start you had an energy of 1 J in 1 cm. If you, with the same energy, spam the volume to 10 cm, the energy will be lesser in each part of 1 cm, agree with me?
But Quantum Mechanics is another thing, and I'll be very happy to share with you all somethings, because sometimes, the comprehension of some aspects of QM is very hard.
And giving attention to Frater Ceytin words, energy, in it's physical aspects and idea, is not correlated with metaphysics thoughts like 'the soul is energy. When you die, it's only transformation' is very wrong. Sciences like Physics, Biology, Chemistry and the others correlated to them NEVER speak of 'soul', 'god', 'pray' or any other metaphysical things that will never be proven.

_________________
'Is man an error of god, or is god an error of man?'
(F. W. Nietzsche)

Wikipedia(lol?!): "A physician is a health care provider who practices the profession of medicine, which is concerned with promoting, maintaining or restoring human health through the study, diagnosis, and treatment of disease, injury and other physical and mental impairments."

not sure what this has to do with physics, but I like the rest of your post. xD

_________________
Ich bin Gott(los)

Sorry for this mistake of mine.
I'm a physicist.

_________________
'Is man an error of god, or is god an error of man?'
(F. W. Nietzsche)

Well, not exactly. Only, not how the "mystics" mean it: The electrical energy responsible for things like thought (which generates consciousness and the idea of a "self" or "soul") does move towards a higher entropic state... meaning it dissipates. "You" ceases to be. Period, end of story.

Likewise, the matter in the body is re-assimilated into other organic things (you know... eaten. By bugs and bacteria) or in very rare instances, fossilized. But the body ceases to be as well.

At the moment of death the self disappears, ne'er to be seen or heard form again.


But, one does have to wonder what this may mean for the conservation of information which is also integral (though often over looked) to physical laws. Suskind won the bet.

_________________
"I would believe in the god Chaos, you know, if he was around. I think he's not a god with a plan; a god without a plan! A god going, 'What? Me? I didn't know!'" -Eddie Izzard

"You know what they call "alternative medicine" that has been proven to work? Medicine." -Tim Minchin

Interesting... interesting. If information is always preserved then that opens the possibility that existance beyond the physical body could continue. I know of one proponent of this but his idea of the afterlife is not very comforting. He believes that the information of our conciousness does get imprinted onto the fabric of the universe just as you save information on your computer. However while the information is there, it is retained as data only. The concoiusness and it's uniqueness is preserved but in read only format. By viewing it you can tell who it was and what it did but the data is not alive, it is merely text information with no life of its own. You are preserved but as inert information only. Your essence survives but your life is indeed over. Not a very comforting view of the hereafter.

_________________
Our father whoart in Hell unhallowed be thy name. Thy dominion come, thy will be done on Earth as it is in Hell. Grant us this day our daily pleasure and bring suffering to our enemies... and lead us not into slavery but deliver us unto freedom. For thine is the power and the glory and the majesty forever and ever. Hail Satan

Lets assume for a moment that we developed the technology to accurately record all the information in an individual's brain and then place that information into another fresh "blank" brain - like copying the contents of a hard drive. Lets call this individual Dick.
Would Dick now be in a new body? Is this new brain and body still Dick?
What if Dick were placed into a female body - would Dick still be Dick?
Is Dick only the information stored in his brain, or is Dick the sum total of his body and the information in his brain combined?
I mean - what makes Dick, Dick, is his experience in his original body. To place his consciousness into a new body would mean that Dick is no longer Dick - or would it?

_________________
ceytin
-------
"Learn to accept, even welcome pain - for if you do not fear pain... if the thought of physical, emotional or spiritual anguish cannot dissuade you from the true path - then no enemy, however strong, can defeat you...no struggle, however long, can deter you...nor circumstance, however wrong, can keep you from your destiny."

Data or information only exists if there is someone or something to interpret that data.

Take a book for example. It's made up of paper and pages, letters, words and paragraphs. The most valuable part of a book (generally) is not the physical item - the paper and pages - but the content, the story within the words and paragraphs.

But lets say that humans became extinct tomorrow, and aliens found this book but could not understand the letters (symbols) and could not decipher the story or understand the language. Is that story still there? If no-one in the universe is able to decipher it? does it still exist? or is it merely pages and pages of random symbols?

_________________
ceytin
-------
"Learn to accept, even welcome pain - for if you do not fear pain... if the thought of physical, emotional or spiritual anguish cannot dissuade you from the true path - then no enemy, however strong, can defeat you...no struggle, however long, can deter you...nor circumstance, however wrong, can keep you from your destiny."

Ceytin says: But lets say that humans became extinct tomorrow, and aliens found this book but could not understand the letters (symbols) and could not decipher the story or understand the language. Is that story still there? If no-one in the universe is able to decipher it? does it still exist? or is it merely pages and pages of random symbols?

Well, we have a exemple of that behind the ancient scriptures of Mayan civilization.
The recordings on stone, in their temples, is not well translated, for there's no 'rosetta stone'-like device to do so. The same goes for Vikings, for our comprehension of their culture comes from supposions, not by translations, for it is very hard.
Been more direct: to understand a language, it's needed to have something that can make a bridge over the dead symbols and the nowadays languages...
And about supposions of a 'afterlife stage', based on Science, to me, is a very naive thing, or the smartest one (by the means that some guys gets thousands of money with this)...

_________________
'Is man an error of god, or is god an error of man?'
(F. W. Nietzsche)

The answer to this depends entirely on your conception of "original": I think it was Ankou who started a thread a long while back about transhumanism where this is kind of already adressed so I'll just go with the reader's digest version:

If you "are" your body, than the person you are at night is different than in the morning as cells are replaced. Likewise, if you lose a limb, you're no longer you.

If you "are" your brain/mind, then if you have a stroke or a hormone imbalance you're no longer you.

Or are you something else?

I don't have an answer to it and find myself vacilating between answers.

_________________
"I would believe in the god Chaos, you know, if he was around. I think he's not a god with a plan; a god without a plan! A god going, 'What? Me? I didn't know!'" -Eddie Izzard

"You know what they call "alternative medicine" that has been proven to work? Medicine." -Tim Minchin